2016 FORMULA 1 GROSSER PREIS VON ÖSTERREICH

[norbs]

Seeing the video for the first time, I have a few questions. Did LH know of NR's brake issue? Did he reel him in quickly over the previous few laps? If either answer is yes, then LH is a bigger fucking idiot than I thought. He had 75% of the lap to get past, why go up the outside there knowing full well the other car can just drive straight to push him off track. Fuck, it isnt like it has never been done before.

I don't accept some people saying LH took his wing off on purpose. That is a fucking big gamble of a puncture I would have thought.

[Duke]

T2 & the next corner (T3) are really the only notable passing places around that track.
Rosberg took the inside early out of T1 leaving only the outside for Lewis to attack using DRS. I don't think Lewis was trying to win at all costs into T2. But rather make sure that if he didn't make the pass he could hold the outside or get an undercut then accelerate better out of it to pass Rosberg into T3.
I also don't think he would've known about Rosberg's brake issue as if I'm not mistaken that's banned with the new radio rules.

Who's saying Hammy took his front wing off on purpose? That's just ludicrous, must be those Germans who travelled over the border then booed the podium. TWAT'S!!!

[KNAPPO]

Fan view video.




Not trying to defend any driver here but.

IF Rosbergs brakes went cactus on/towards the last lap he only had 1, maybe 2 braking zones to assess what he had under him. He stuffed up T1 and T2 is the heaviest braking zone on the track. It would have been very difficult to know how much they would have been able to stop him. Add the factor that he was directly under attack and a pass was on would have made his situation even more difficult to read.

Loowis put himself in the position and this was the result. Yeah he left a shed load of room and Nico defended the inside line attack around half way down the straight, but if the bloke you are racing has a problem stopping (which Loowis wouldnt have known about) this is the risk you take going on the outside.

[w00dsy]

I'm not quite buying Rosbergs brakes being as bad as they say. You generally don't hit the inside kerb of T1 if you're having trouble stopping. His tyres were knackered but I'm not convinced his brakes were gone. Either way it's exciting watching these 2 knuckleheads constantly hitting each other. I dont think I've ever seen 2 team mates hit as often as they do.

[KNAPPO]

Either way it's exciting watching these 2 knuckleheads constantly hitting each other. I dont think I've ever seen 2 team mates hit as often as they do.

I just wish they would do it properly like they did in Barcelona. Makes the Grand Prix so much more interesting.

[Duke]

Maybe I am seeing things differently but from that fan video it appears to me that Rosberg's rate of descent changes.
It almost appears that he releases the brakes a bit to ensure he keeps Lewis on-his outside. Maybe that was due to his "so called brake issue" or just that he wanted to ensure he kept Lewis wide & stalled Lewis so he couldn't undercut. Nothing wrong with that as it's part of the tactics of good racing.
But it still doesn't help that either way he left no room for Lewis to stay on track in that corner. They were side-by-side so room has to be given as per the rules.
I also agree that he had the right to maintain a racing line out of the corner as Lewis was off-track which is why Lewis had to back-out of it but the damage was done by then anyway.

[Durrie]

They were side-by-side so room has to be given as per the rules.

You mean this rule?

Any driver moving back towards the racing line, having earlier
defended his position off-line, should leave at least one car
width between his own car and the edge of the track on the
approach to the corner.

However, manoeuvres liable to hinder other drivers, such as
deliberate crowding of a car beyond the edge of the track or
any other abnormal change of direction, are strictly prohibited.
Any driver who appears guilty of any of the above offences will
be reported to the Stewards.

[Duke]

Yes that's the one Durrie, is that how it's officially written?

[VTRacing]

But that only applies on the approach to a corner...to stop people weaving down the straight etc.

I can't find anything in my quick scan of the Regs that defines what drivers are supposed to do during corners. Clearly (by various examples over the years) the driver who is ahead on the exit is permitted to use the full extent of the track as if the car behind (on the outside) is not there, even if there is a significant overlap with a car on the outside.

[VTRacing]

The only other regulation that deals with collisions is this one:

38.1 "Incident" means any occurrence or series of occurrences involving one or more drivers, or
any action by any driver, which is reported to the stewards by the race director (or noted by
the stewards and subsequently investigated) which :

a) Necessitated the suspension of a race under Article 41.
b) Constituted a breach of these Sporting Regulations or the Code.
c) Caused a false start by one or more cars.
d) Caused a collision.
e) Forced a driver off the track.
f) Illegitimately prevented a legitimate overtaking manoeuvre by a driver.
g) Illegitimately impeded another driver during overtaking.

But those situations are not defined.

[Durrie]

Yes that's the one Durrie, is that how it's officially written?

See Appendix L on this page http://www.fia.com/regulation/category/123

The section those words were taken from is Chapter IV 2 b)

Only the paragraph about moving back to the racing line is about approaching a corner. All the others relate to conduct generally.

38.1 of the F1 sporting regulations (a different document to the one linked above) only governs what race directors in F1 races may report to the stewards and what the stewards are allowed to do about it. It doesn't govern conduct. The "Code" to which it refers includes the Appendix L noted above, which does regulate conduct.

[Cursed]

It's just like the old days of MNR in here now

[r8response]

It's just like the old days of MNR in here now

Some things are better left buried

[VTRacing]

It's just like the old days of MNR in here now

Haha, I debated whether it would be wise to post on this subject.

[w00dsy]

It's a very similar situation to the one between Rossi and Marquez last year where the inside guy pushes the guy on the outside further to the edge of the track. At the time there was a bunch of people saying the person on the outside has to wait for the inside guy to turn, he can't just turn when he thinks he should, which I thought was odd. But I haven't seen the rules so my understanding is more or less based on what is the most as sporting thing to do. Which is dont be a prick and drive someone off the road.

[Duke]

It's a good point w00dsy.
It could be argued Hammy shouldn't have turned in when he did but he obviously thought Rosberg couldn't turn any later & he expected to be given a bit of a room. As you say be a little bit sporting but this just tells me that Rosberg is just as much of a prick but his execution is worse than Lewis.

[Dr. Pain]

He was always going for it and Rosberg was always going to try and screw him. At least they give Sky another chance to animate them colliding for next years intro sequence.

[renesis37]

Watch that and tell me who made the dive bomb

[w00dsy]

here's a question. If a team is heading for a certain 1-2, with a healthy lead in the race, should the drivers be allowed to fight on the last lap or should they hold station and think of the team rather than themselves? Red Bull certainly didn't allow fighting amongst the drivers late in the race, they nipped that in the bud after the Turkey incident. Vettel was scolded by the world just for passing when told not too, he didn't actually hit his team mate. McLaren initially gave Prost and Senna until the first corner to fight it out and then told them hold station, which Senna once ignored. My point being, as much as i think it was caused by Rosberg, should Lewis be allowed to fight his teammate on the last lap and potentially throw away a guaranteed 1-2?

[norbs]

here's a question. If a team is heading for a certain 1-2, with a healthy lead in the race, should the drivers be allowed to fight on the last lap or should they hold station and think of the team rather than themselves? Red Bull certainly didn't allow fighting amongst the drivers late in the race, they nipped that in the bud after the Turkey incident. Vettel was scolded by the world just for passing when told not too, he didn't actually hit his team mate. McLaren initially gave Prost and Senna until the first corner to fight it out and then told them hold station, which Senna once ignored. My point being, as much as i think it was caused by Rosberg, should Lewis be allowed to fight his teammate on the last lap and potentially throw away a guaranteed 1-2?

Nope, and I was coming in to say something very similar, although I didnt think of it, a guy I work with told me today.

How many points did that cost them in the constructors? Imagine if LH had punctured and not been able to finish the race. What if it came down to that at the end of the season? Yes, I know it most likely wont, but a bird in the hand blah blah.

That said, let them slam into each other every race, makes it more fun to watch. I bet the other teams are grinning knowing they are fighting amongst themselves.

[r8response]

As much as Hamilton is a dick, that has to be Rosbergs fault. Straight lined until the last point. What was Hamilton meant to do?

[w00dsy]

Nope, and I was coming in to say something very similar, although I didnt think of it, a guy I work with told me today.

How many points did that cost them in the constructors? Imagine if LH had punctured and not been able to finish the race. What if it came down to that at the end of the season? Yes, I know it most likely wont, but a bird in the hand blah blah.

That said, let them slam into each other every race, makes it more fun to watch. I bet the other teams are grinning knowing they are fighting amongst themselves.

as a spectator i say let them race until the end, but as a team owner i'd say fuck no. It'll be interesting to see what Wolff and Lauda decide.

[Dr. Pain]

This seems so fitting seeing it's a German vehicle

[norbs]

It'll be interesting to see what Wolff and Lauda decide.

Every time I hear (the drums echoing tonight) his name......

[Jamo]

This seems so fitting seeing it's a German vehicle

Designed and built in Brackley, with an engine built in Brixworth, both are in Northamptonshire I believe. Tis about as German as Lewis Hamilton