More Spitfires!

[Dr. Pain]

They found a dozen in Burma and they are to be dug up. They are buried unassembled in transport crates, the parts are waxed and wrapped in greased paper and all the joints are tarred. There could be another 40 more hidden in other areas too.

[Nigel]

If they haven't rusted to death.

[J.D.]

http://www.arseforums.com/phpBB/viewtop ... 07#p336507" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The references to the Battle of Britain are getting tiresome. Comments like "They saved our neck" ignore the contributions of other types - in particular the Hurricane. It also misses the point that there is very little commonality between the Battle of Britain era MkI and the Griffon-powered MkXIV that they are expecting to find.

[Dr. Pain]

They were a real brute by Mk.XIV. Dangerous to fly too with the Griffon spinning opposite to the Merlin and being 10 litres more in engine capacity. Pilots said you had to take off with full right rudder because of the torque. Wasn't as sweet sounding as the Merlin but still makes a great noise.
[youtube] [/youtube]

[J.D.]

Just one note on that video: despite what the title says, that is a PR MkXIX painted like a MkXIVc and not a XIVe, which had a cut down rear fuselage and a bubble canopy. Otherwise the difference is not that great.

Someone should turn that commentator into a wheel chock. He's actually trying to shout over the top of the engine noise.

[smithcorp]

It might be sacrilege, but I think I might prefer the sound of the Griffon.

[Coopz]

http://www.arseforums.com/phpBB/viewtop ... 07#p336507

The references to the Battle of Britain are getting tiresome. Comments like "They saved our neck" ignore the contributions of other types - in particular the Hurricane. It also misses the point that there is very little commonality between the Battle of Britain era MkI and the Griffon-powered MkXIV that they are expecting to find.

True. The Hurricane won the Battle of Britain and was the preferred plane of the 2 from most of the pilots point of view. Only slightly slower and not as twitchy or flickable but more forgiving, easier to throw around and much more rugged. My Grandfather worked on both fighters during the war and always said the Hurricane was the better aircraft.

[J.D.]

In 1940, yes.

In 1941, no.

Such was the pace of development.

[durbster]

A few weeks ago I read a book entirely about the development of the Spitfire, and I still know less than JD

[J.D.]

He, he... I don't know that much about Spitfires.

That book you read...it wasn't Leo McKinstry's book was it?

[Big Kev]

Seems they've found an underground crate but it's full of muddy water so they can't tell what's in it yet.

[durbster]

Doesn't bode well really. I can't imagine there is much left if they've been sat in water for 70 years. Something seems a bit odd about this project to me, there's a lot of promising press releases and not a lot else.

JD, to answer your question from a million years ago above that I missed at the time, the book was by Jeffrey Quill, one of the test pilots.

[Big Kev]

Archaeologists hunting for World War II Spitfires in Burma believe there are no planes buried at the sites where they have been digging, the BBC understands.

The archaeologists have concluded that evidence does not support the original claim that as many as 124 Spitfires were buried at the end of the war, the BBC's Fergal Keane reports.

Wargaming.net, the firm financing the dig, has also said there are no planes.

But project leader David Cundall says they are looking in the wrong place.

He told the BBC that he still believes Spitfires are buried at Rangoon airport and other sites.

[smithcorp]

Very sad -what an enormous waste of money based, it seems, on some faulty recollections (or a throw-away comment) of some old blokes. Not sure why anyone would go to the effort of burying a couple of hundred giant crates anyway.

[Big Kev]

Sadly they've found nada

Archaeologists have called off a hunt for World War II Spitfires in Burma.
Originally it was thought as many as 124 Spitfires were buried by the RAF at the end of the war but they have now concluded it was a myth.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-21483187" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[J.D.]

There's one bit about this I just don't get.

124 aircraft is a hell of a big number. The best way to establish anything about this before spending any money would have been to consult the RAF records office. Every aircraft ever built and used in RAF service will be in there, barring one or two. The records I've seen will show all the relevant data such as engine and airframe numbers, date of acceptance into service, date struck off charge (lost in combat, damaged beyond repair, scrapped. sold etc.).

Why didn't someone find out if 124 aircraft sent to Burma were even missing before they started looking for them? For the amount of money it cost to do this, you could have built a brand new Mk XIVe from scratch.

[r8response]

For the guy that funded this trip, this is probably pocket change to him.

[smithcorp]

There's one bit about this I just don't get.

124 aircraft is a hell of a big number. The best way to establish anything about this before spending any money would have been to consult the RAF records office. Every aircraft ever built and used in RAF service will be in there, barring one or two. The records I've seen will show all the relevant data such as engine and airframe numbers, date of acceptance into service, date struck off charge (lost in combat, damaged beyond repair, scrapped. sold etc.).

Why didn't someone find out if 124 aircraft sent to Burma were even missing before they started looking for them? For the amount of money it cost to do this, you could have built a brand new Mk XIVe from scratch.

This is what I can't understand - where's the background checks and professionalism before spending this sort of effort and bucks?

[J.D.]

I have a big end cap from the engine of a MkII PR Spitfire, AB130, which crashed in August, 1942. I know where it crashed and why. I know where it was going and who was flying it. Most importantly, I know its serial number, when it was delivered to the RAF and when it was struck off charge.

I doubt if there are more than a handful of aircraft which remain unaccounted for (including those which went into the Channel).

“¿Qué gigantes?”

[smithcorp]

This story has it all. Here's a release from Wargaming Ltd, the poor saps who funded this thing:

The Wargaming team now believes, based on clear documentary evidence, as well as the evidence from the fieldwork, that no Spitfires were delivered in crates and buried at RAF Mingaladon during 1945 and 1946.

Most significantly, the archival records show that the RAF unit that handled shipments through Rangoon docks – 41 Embarkation Unit – only received 37 aircraft in total from three transport ships between 1945 and 1946. None of the crates contained Spitfires and most appear to have been re-exported in the Autumn of 1946.

http://forum.keypublishing.com/showpost ... count=2334" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

But, even better than that, the 'brains' behind the outfit, Cundall, vows to dig on, in denial:

YANGON - A British Spitfire enthusiast vowed Tuesday to continue searching for the World War II planes in Myanmar after the project's sponsor pulled out saying stories of buried aircraft were just "legend".

David Cundall said he remained "very confident" about the prospects of finding the iconic single-seater aircraft at Yangon airport in the Mingaladon district of the city, despite splitting with the project's backer.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews ... yanmar-dig" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

smiss

[J.D.]

Ride on, Sancho Panza.

[durbster]

It seems difficult to believe they didn't do the most basic of research. I know you get people who want to believe something so strongly that they will become blind to anything that deflects their path and that enthusiasm can be contageous enough to convince a naive investor but I can't help thinking there's more to this whole farce, as if it was being used to draw our attention to Burma after their recent political upheaval for some reason.