A.R.S.E.

The sport should be bigger than the engine manufacturers. It existed before them and it will exist after them. Bernie just liked having them there, they are good for money and promotion. F1 should be bigger than the sum or its parts. What I mean by that, is that F1 should attract engine manufacturers because of it's prestige, not F1 having to pander to the manufacturers to get them there.

Have you watched formula E? It's like watching racing with the sound off. They should add speakers on the cars to actually make some sort of noise but then people will think they have normal engines in them and that negates the point of the formula.

Big Kev wrote:Have you watched formula E? It's like watching racing with the sound off. They should add speakers on the cars to actually make some sort of noise but then people will think they have normal engines in them and that negates the point of the formula.

I spent many years racing electric R/C cars, so the Formula E noise is very familiar. Amazing how little difference there is between the full size cars and the 1/10th scales we raced.

Big Kev wrote:Have you watched formula E? It's like watching racing with the sound off. They should add speakers on the cars to actually make some sort of noise but then people will think they have normal engines in them and that negates the point of the formula.

I just visualised F1 cars roaring around on electric motors (Formula E) blasting Green Sleeves at 100 decibels.

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The days of the big shouty cars are gone. Only way you will get them back is to run old engines and it's clear that Ross Brawn does not want that. We should grateful that they can't harness engine noise at this stage, in time they will. Noise is wasted energy and at some point they'll tap it. But even in the short term with engines getting more efficient and changing fuel, it will change it forever.

So they need to preserve and run the big shouty cars at race weekends.

Ferrari diffuser work.

Scarbs: "diffusers work by having a powerful vortex run up inside the to corner. These findms produce a natching vortex that helps power the inner flow for more flow through the diffuser = more downforce"

^ bloody hell.

What an abomination, thankfully it would be hard to see especially during telecasts.

Oh dear... Nando....

Fernando Alonso has pinned the blame for McLaren's 2017 trouble on Honda, saying its new Formula 1 engine has no power and no reliability.
"I don't think we are too far back in terms of chassis side," he said, when asked to assess McLaren's position.

"We have only one problem: that is the power unit.

"There is no reliability and there is no power. We are 30km/h down on the straight, every straight.

"So when you are 30km/h down on every straight it is difficult to have a feeling on the car.

"We'll be fully ready to compete in a good level, the only question mark is how much power we will have."

When asked whether he was able to take Barcelona's Turn 3 flat out, Alonso also made a joke about the lack of performance.

"Oh yeah, for us, not only Turn 3," he smiled. "For us nearly all the corners are flat."

Fastest car for each manufacturer

Mercedes (Bottas) 338.5km/h
Renault (Verstappen) 331.2km/h
Ferrari (Raikkonen) 327.2km/h
Honda (Alonso) 312.1km/h

F1 2016 vs 2017 On-board comparison Mercedes Hamilton vs Bottas
Hamilton Pole 2016 vs Bottas test week 2 in Spain Circuit de Barcelona-Catalunya, Spanish Grand Prix

2017 kills 2016 in the corners but the wider tyres and wider wings do slow them down on the straights. Which has happened in the past. I remember in the difference between the 1997 and 1998 cars. Changing them from 7 foot wide to 6 foot wide made them pretty damn quick at old Hockenheim.

Supers vs softs aswell.

True but the mid corner grip from just bigger tyres and aero chances are noticeable.

I can't believe Honda are still so far off on top speed, surely the development of these power units is starting to mature?

I'd like to know how McLarens constraints have played a roll in reduced performance.

As for Nandos comments. Isn't that typical he has an outburst and the team rolls their eyes?

Duke wrote:I can't believe Honda are still so far off on top speed, surely the development of these power units is starting to mature?

It's like Toyota F1 all over again. They (Honda) don't listen to those that actually know better, they just follow their own set path.

Maybe it's nostalgia making people think the McLaren/Honda combo will work, but Honda were rubbish the last time they were in F1 and that wasn't that long ago. Even at the tail end of the Senna era they were losing their way. They went and built a V12 while everyone else was developing the mighty V10's.

Yep, it's naive to think the badge on its own is enough. The engineers that built the successful Honda engines are presumably long gone. Even if they hadn't retired, the people with those skills would surely have left in the gaps between Honda's campaigns.

Honda are good at building engines, but normal engines not hybrids. What they did at the tail end of the turbo era and the V-12's, they were good and their MotoGP engines are pretty damn good too. A hybrid seems a step too far for them at the moment and it's pretty clear that you need to build engines in Europe or England. Toyota found that out.

Do you all realise that Honda are bringing a new engine to F1 this year, not an evolution of there last two years engine. At the end of last season, the token system was removed, so both Renault and Honda took the opportunity to make or at least heavily modify their engines. Honda completely revamped the layout. Remember those days not too long ago when new engines were introduced, they'd be going pop at the first test like crazy.

Honda know how to engineer a motor, remember they have dominated MotoGP in years past and some of the technology they brought there were massive.

Now I'm not defending them fully, they do have their issues, but I think a company as big as Honda will get it right, but of all the teams, they've probably made the biggest changes from 16 to 17. The token system really fucked them over in terms of catching up on development as compared to the other teams as well.

So just be a little less critical of them, they still might suck by Melbourne, but they aren't dumbo's either.

Even without the token system they will probably only update once or twice a year because the updates only apply to the remaining unused engines or you take a stupid grid-load of penalties but at least it means they can catch up with major changes rather than little ones that use up valuable tokens. I hope they get it right eventually but it's going to take them a couple more years I think.

aaaaand the McLaren has just broken down again.
I don't think they've done a full race distance yet.

Muppet wrote:So just be a little less critical of them

Nope, fuck 'em. First two tests and it's the same shit different engine.