anyone ever lost the plot?

[w00dsy]

Is it selfish to put yourself first, when ultimately it will help your family if you're more content and less stressed in your job? I reckon once you feel a bit better, start looking again. It really seems like it would help a lot of the issues. Even if it's a job to keep you going until you score what you really want. I just don't think it's worth being unhappy in your job.

if i didn't have 3 other people to put before me i'd agree with you, In fact i do agree with you and it's part of the ongoing discussions that regularly happen at our house. I personally think a job on wages would be better for all of us. I'd be happier and more relaxed, we'd know what was coming in every week even if it was less than we're used to, and i'd get paid holidays. But i can't really earn less than the bills that are coming in just for my own happiness. I heard a saying a while ago that the order of importance in a family is kids, wife, dog, husband. I know a few guys that feel that way, i guess it's just how it goes when you take on the role. Mums sacrifice a lot too but in a different way. It's just what you do when you have a family, house etc.

[w00dsy]

good post cj

[c.j]

Is it selfish to put yourself first, when ultimately it will help your family if you're more content and less stressed in your job? I reckon once you feel a bit better, start looking again. It really seems like it would help a lot of the issues. Even if it's a job to keep you going until you score what you really want. I just don't think it's worth being unhappy in your job.

if i didn't have 3 other people to put before me i'd agree with you, In fact i do agree with you and it's part of the ongoing discussions that regularly happen at our house. I personally think a job on wages would be better for all of us. I'd be happier and more relaxed, we'd know what was coming in every week even if it was less than we're used to, and i'd get paid holidays. But i can't really earn less than the bills that are coming in just for my own happiness. I heard a saying a while ago that the order of importance in a family is kids, wife, dog, husband. I know a few guys that feel that way, i guess it's just how it goes when you take on the role. Mums sacrifice a lot too but in a different way. It's just what you do when you have a family, house etc.

This is an example of our culture right there. Occasionally, you need to take the best lamb cutlet. If you get my meaning. Don't 100% of the time put everyone else first. It's ok if you put yourself at the front of the list, especially if you're in a bad place mentally. Kids adapt, wives are reassuring. It only becomes an issue if that becomes your routine, but you guys know that.
My method is to pick a place I want to go every now and again. Kids and wife tag along and we share. i.e if I want to go to the bike show and drool over motorcycles etc. My missus couldn't care less about motorcycles, but she does it because she knows I need that little injection occasionally.

So no Dex, it's not mate.

in my opinion

[Dr. Pain]

Work will do it Woodsy. My sister is a stress head and a chef. She was in a work place that was dysfunctional with the owners of the business trying to run it from 1000 kilometres away. One of her oesophagus sphincters fucked up and she got really bad reflux. She is fit and active being a runner and not what the specialist would expect to have such a problem. She left that business and her stress levels dropped, her digestive issues started to clear up. She still has the odd trouble now but we really try not to let her stress. When she starts to stress it will return.

It's really strange how your body does react to stress and it's a massive problem in our modern lives.

[w00dsy]

One of her oesophagus sphincters fucked up and she got really bad reflux.

i haven't had it checked out but i get bad reflux. I wouldn't have thought it'd be stress related but it could be.

[Dr. Pain]

Get it checked out because it could be due to stress. My sister was getting acid burns around her mouth over night. Took her a long time to recover from it.

[w00dsy]

Just thought i'd bump this again to see how everyone is going. Anxiety has been kicking my arse for the last few months, now back on meds to hopefully sort it out. Been about 6 weeks and it's kinda helped. But i've become a shocking hypochondriac with it. I'm catastrophising every little pain or twitch i get, the wife has banned me from googling symptoms.

[DarrenM]

I had some bad anxiety issues earlier in the year but it's settled down now. I'd arranged to have a few reno's done on the house (door replacements, tree removal etc) which ended up being more expensive than I thought they would be.I ended up having to cancel one of them because I couldn't handle it. It sent me in a downward spiral stressing out about whether it was the right move, whether I should have got more quotes etc. I think I just piled too much on at once. Also doesn't help that I feel I should be looking for a new job right now (current one has gone too quiet) but feel my skills have gone downhill.

I think something that has helped me is going through my finances and sorting out my budget again in detail. When I bought this place ~10 years ago I wrote a program to do it which would allow me to do a 1 year forecast and have a monthly summary to see how I was doing but I stopped using it after a couple years. Setting that up again has let me see I'm in a bit better position than I thought I was which takes some pressure off.

[Dr. Pain]

Short answer, fucked! Never been in this position in my life and I don't like it at all.

[Santaria]

I work with vulnerable young people with a variety of mental health issues, also on the brink of suicide, in which I discuss strategies and methods to overcome or manage them. I have also worked with men on the brink of suicide as well as mental health issues. In both of those cases, especially for the males, there is one glaring issue that arises: actual, real, close male friends. One's we could talk about this stuff about without fear of being judged or made fun of. The older we get, the more it dwindles. There was research I was reading that men over the age of 35, especially with kids, are lucky yo have 1 person they could call a "best mate" in terms of what I mentioned before. Many men have many acquaintences and would not mention what is happening for them even though statistically 1 in every 4 males you talk to are suffering.

My truth is that anxiety is the consequence of not exercising that "muscle" in our brains that regulates the looped thinking and mini movies in our heads that cause distress. If you have anyone to talk to, preferably male (we're predominately males on this forum) to share your difficulties, take that opportunity now. If you don't, I am more than happy to tlak about it on a more personal basis either over phone or Facebook. Just PM me and I'll prvide details.

To be clear, there's many more "things" that surround us, past and present, that build on the anxiety/depression.

Sorry if I detracted a bit from your posts Woodsy, Darren and Doc.

[w00dsy]

No that was an excellent response Shaun, I keep meaning to ring you for a chat but I always forget. I've found my wife has been a brilliant voice of reason for me lately. Even at 3am if I'm having a panic attack she is willing to be woken to calm me down.

[Dr. Pain]

Don't be sorry Santa as you made some great points. I'm grieving for my mum and I'm not alone with this in my everyday life, even in this forum.

[Santaria]

No that was an excellent response Shaun, I keep meaning to ring you for a chat but I always forget. I've found my wife has been a brilliant voice of reason for me lately. Even at 3am if I'm having a panic attack she is willing to be woken to calm me down.

It's awesome that we do have women in our lives, especially ones who listen. Unfortunately no matter how hard they try they'll never "get" being a male. It's truly something that is innate and not something that can be learnt, my truth. Mid night panic attacks are shit house, lol.

You don't suffer from sleep apnoea by any chance?

[Santaria]

Don't be sorry Santa as you made some great points. I'm grieving for my mum and I'm not alone with this in my everyday life, even in this forum.

One thing men fucking SUCK at is talking about it. If you can, talk to anyone who'll listen. Men are 4 times more likely to suicide then women. Women talk, men don't.

[Dr. Pain]

I've been seeking counselling about it and have another level to step up to if I need it.

[durbster]

A few weeks ago I met up with a few mates in the pub and we spent the evening just talking the usual bollocks. To describe it, it would seem like nothing really but it made me realise how long it'd been since doing something like that, and how important it is to just talk man shit for a few hours every now and again.

And when we were going through some rough stuff that life threw at us recently, I think having a weekend away with the lads (Spa 24, was awesome ) was one of the best things I did to help keep me on track.

I'm posting cautiously because I don't think I've been there (yet ), but I just think there's a lot in what Santaria is saying. Having mates around you and giving yourself the opportunity to talk bloke things with blokes, is extremely important.

[GXTracker]

Agreed Durbs. I also didn't realize how important that male bond is until we had new neighbours move in right next door. They're around the same age as us so they're going through similar life experiences right now as we are. My wife also has some neurological disorders and her symptoms over the last year have put a bit of a strain on our relationship. Being able to talk to your wife about things is helpful but like Santaria said, they'll never truly understand the male brain and how we think - just like we'll never truly understand them. It's surprising how therapeutic something so simple as having a beer or two in the garage with your buddy next door is.

I realized after we got married that i had kind of put aside the hobbies and activities that made me happy when I was younger - Just getting through day to day life was enough work and there wasn't a lot of time for hobbies. What i realized though was that those interests i had were "me", and not making time for them was like forgetting a part of me. just talking to my buds about mutual interests like Auto Racing or Computers made me feel like a different person then the one i had become now.

I've also recently learned that having a brother that I'm close with is invaluable. if you have anyone like that in your life then reach out to them. learning that he was going through similar feelings was both a little sad and, in a way, reassuring. reassuring in the sense that i wasn't alone. knowing what i know now i make damn sure I'm available for him if he ever needs to vent, and he does the same for me.

last year was a bit rocky for me, but so far this year is on the upswing. im making changes to make sure that stays on course.

[norbs]

I think the mad sessions are very under estimated in the whole mental health thing.

I have a few sessions a week with the cycling guys. The annual boys weekend (woodsy travels 2000km round trip for it) is always a great release.

Talk to your mates. In the flesh if you can.

[Cursed]

Sorry, but blokey bonding does nothing for me. Having someone that I can be completely frank with, without any judgemental nonsense is what works for me. That person happens to be my wife. I've never had that kind of relationship with other men. When I've gone too deep into my introverted shell, clueing the Mrs in on what was going on has been the release valve the couple of times that I needed it.

I'd guess it has something to do with having someone to be able to spill your guts to, whether its an old friend, spouse or someone you pay $150+/hr to. Of course some are better placed for offering advice than others.

[norbs]

Not everything works for everyone Cursed. And some of us have been lucky and dont have a lot to be freaked out about.

A local guy saw a mate go under a car up on the local climb. He cradled him until the air ambo arrived. That would shake a bloke up. When he got home, his wife told him to harden up! He ended up over hear, crying his eyes out. He obviously doesnt have what you have.

[Dr. Pain]

It's not about blokey bonding, it's about talking shit to take your mind off things and having a laugh.

[ysu]

Cursed, you're one lucky man. I've only ever been able to bond like that with my father. That's it, no-one ever since. I quite miss it, to be honest. It's one thing that keeps coming back to me and I sometimes actually cry over, still. I miss the old man greatly.

Yeah manly fun is one thing; I do need that, too.

But a bit of me-time is another. For me this is almost equally important I think. I use kayaking to get that, currently. It used to be rock climbing; when it's just me and whatever is around me, and all I have to do is one thing; climb that pitch or take the kayak to the end of the peninsula under 20 mins. No work, no family no fucking anything, but me and my fun time.
I can also use listening to (good!) loud music this way, sometimes.

Running & bicycle does not work that well, I've noticed; too many other distractions, other people, traffic, whatnot.

It's my mental relaxation/recharge.

[Santaria]

I also want to talk about socialising as well as talking to those we know and love. Social media has done well at connecting everyone but at the same time it's done very well at making everyone acquaintances. For me without the guys I ride with on my motorbike I'd really only have my brother. My old man is old school and prefers the stoic stance. "She'll be right, mate!"

I try to let the young guys I work with and support that it's ok to cry. To be fair I would say as soon as I give them permission to, 80% of them do. Proper. Ugly. Crying. The pressure is immense on blokes these days, more than it ever has been in the past, my truth. We're not equipped to hold in emotion.

Not gunna lie guys, this is my passion. I read through my posts here and it seems to chop and change and be confusing. It's not intentional, I just have a lot to say about the subject, lol.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

[Jiminee]

Have had some issues over the past few years which I will detail at a later date but went so, so close to crossing some sort of line today.

I work for a company that was (maybe still might be) on the brink of total collapse for a number of years (this played a huge role in my issues) so a number of bad habits have developed. I cant go into too much detail so excuse me being vague but long story short, on Tuesday afternoon our main server had a 'catastrophic failure' - upshot was no access to my work files since and as we found out at 4pm today - they have only being able to restore from Friday - so all the work done on Monday and Tuesday is gone.

Now I think there are a few fellow draftsman on the forum here so they will probably understand this next part. I had two big projects (for me) that I actually mostly wrapped up on Monday and Tuesday. I had finally gotten a chance to go back and finish them and was very proud of the end result. Monday and Tuesday had been sent sorting and checking item lists (manually - this is in AutoCAD), updating all my cross references etc etc. All the REALLY fussy shit that to me separates a good drafter from a shit one and I had all of this spot on - 18 drawings worth. So when I found out today that it was all gone I was on the fucking rev limiter.

I appreciate shit happens and sometime the holes in the cheese line up and all that but to me it is just unacceptable for one department in a company to let something like that happen. They insist we work off the server so everything gets backed up and yet this is the best they can provide - anyway, that is a different issue.

Normally something like this would send me WAY off the deep end. I was not violent, I dont drink much but I would do something that was, in some way, destructive. I would shut out my family, eat a heap of shitty food, yell and carry on at someone - that kind of thing. Generally waste a lot of time and energy to feel like shit and not actually deal with anything. Well today I was able to feel that building up and actually stopped myself from going down that path - mostly. I was driving home and setting myself for a bit of a blast down a quiet country road but fortunately a copper pulled onto the road just before I did so that put paid to that plan.

I parked up the car and went inside and just spoke to my wife - relatively calmly. My wife and dogs can sense when I'm on the edge like that - its not exactly something new, I have always struggled with my temper and today I was steaming but I went in, explained the situation and actually said "I can feel myself ready to explode - I dont want to but I do not know how to let this go." I know that me going fucking apeshit and throwing stuff around the house is not going to achieve anything but actually having the skills to change paths in that situation is another thing.

Anyway, we talked, went through some options of what to do, settled on going to Target and buying some Lego and then some Hungry Jacks. Now by my standards that would have been a positive outcome but just getting to that point made me realise I did not even need that so I watched a bit of cricket, played with my son (9 months yesterday) and after a couple of hours wrote a draft of a letter of complaint I will forward to my boss tomorrow. Writing this out like this makes me feel a bit silly for thinking all of this was actually some kind of accomplishment but I like knowing I did not unnecessarily upset my wife and son, that I did not scare the shit out of the dogs etc etc - I actually handled it in the best way I could for my current condition.

[durbster]

Sounds like you did alright there Jiminee.

There's definitely an issue with blokes these days but the reasons are complex. Was it always this way and blokes just took everything out on their kids or wives or whatever?

Or is it a modern thing, related to the power shift towards females leaving a lot of blokes not really sure of our place any more. Many of us aren't really represented in the media these days; I barely watch TV now because I can't relate to much of it. Maybe that contributes.

It's not about blokey bonding, it's about talking shit to take your mind off things and having a laugh.

Yep. The pub night I mentioned was just a few beers while we reminisced about a stag do we all went on, talked about modern diesel engines and racing R/C cars. That sort of stuff.

I have to add that because I've not had to go through any of this stuff myself, I'm a bit uneasy posting in this thread, but if I can help at all then I would like to. If anyone fancies firing their problems into another hemisphere then get in touch

One thing, Martin Daubney is a journalist over here who covers this topic comprehensively. I started following him on Twitter as part of my efforts to hear from people I disagreed with, but he actually won me over and made me realise there is a big problem that is not being addressed.

An example:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/thinkin ... elves.html

Worth following on Twitter if you're on there.