Another PC build thread

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Thu May 22, 2014 11:48 am

I know there are many of these, but I feel like it might be better than hijacking someones thread.

I'm happy to do my own investigation on some parts, but I have a few questions as it may save me some time. I also trust the opinions here more than the random info you pickup on various other forums. I was advised to go a Gigabyte board last build when I asked here (about 5 years ago?) and it has been rock solid! I'm a bit of an Asus convert after that. Is gigabyte still making those quality boards with the thicker PCB and japanese capacitors etc??

The other thing I'd like to ask is concerning double, tripple, quad channel ram. I imagine that's largely based on what the board can handle, and the ram would need to be matched in a kit? Is it worth it? I have a spec'd out iMac that I used for my photographic/imaging work. This is purely a gaming PC.

ysu · Post by **ysu** » Thu May 22, 2014 11:53 am

WRT Mobos
I've read in a few places that basically you get what you pay for in this market. Every brand has lower-end and higher-end products, and that's reflected in the features & the quality of components used.
Other than that, there's a bit of a gamble in it, too - there's always duds. But that's what warranty is for. (I'm still buying ASUS by the way, last time I looked their mobos were better in the higher range)

RAM gets a bit quicker if you buy these "sets" (they sell it in sets of 2/3/4 depending on channels). But the overall impact on performance is not too big, usually. If you look at a RAM test and it shows 10% speed increase, you always have to put it in context; it is just one part of the whole PC! If the rest are the same, only some memory operations will be quicker - it does not translate to 10% overall speed increase, more like 2-3%.

In games and work, often more ram means more speed, rather than fast ram. (up to a point; you seldom need more than 16GB or so nowadays)

Post by **Shonky** » Thu May 22, 2014 12:21 pm

I don't know what to tell you Dex, all I will say is every Gigabyte motherboard and video card I've ever bought has died within a few years of owning it (4 years and back). I've since bought both Asrock and Asus parts and both have been fine, but I do wonder if it's just a luck of the draw thing, I've had more SSDs die on me than the average Joe as well so who knows.

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Thu May 22, 2014 1:00 pm

Did you have one of the 'UD' gigabyte mobos die on you?? Having a look at it, it's their 'Ultra Durable' range with thicker PCB and better components (3 yr warranty). It's what I got last time and has been going strong for around 5 years. I bought a Gigabyte vid card too, and no issues with that. I've had some bad experiences with Asus, and seen a hell of a lot of returns of their laptops... I'm not sure they are they company they were in the late 90's and the 2000's. I'm open to whatever though... I don't care for fanboism when it comes to computer parts, it's absurd.

richo · Post by **richo** » Thu May 22, 2014 1:24 pm

I have sold most brands over the years and I find that it's extremely rare to see one brand worse/better than another that said I don't dig MSI stuff but that is only because I had one dud card (my own) .

I try and push Asus Gigabyte and Asrock as budget dictates , it's funny ASrock are meant to be el cheapo and I have never had a problem with them and have always been happy with there "speeds"

Gizmo · Post by **Gizmo** » Thu May 22, 2014 2:41 pm

I've used Asus for ages and never had an issue. Latley i've built afew systems with MSI boards (including my own) and they have been great!

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Thu May 22, 2014 2:46 pm

Gizmo did you go with Asus ROG??

Gizmo · Post by **Gizmo** » Thu May 22, 2014 2:55 pm

Nar, this was years back I was with Asus. All the gaming builds I've done lately have been MSI. They look great, good value and have been rock solid.

wobblysauce · Post by **wobblysauce** » Thu May 22, 2014 3:00 pm

All brands have ones that fail. Cheap or Expensive. Some batches are bad or just the model types are not up to snuff, Platter Hdd's are a big thing with this as it has moving parts.

For you question about capacitors.
http://www.powerguru.org/reliability-of ... apacitors/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Warranty's cover the main part of early failures with extended coverage in the period of it is going to Work or fail. Covers nearly every product on the market.

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Thu May 22, 2014 3:34 pm

I didn't have a question on capacitors, but cheers.

Post by **Shonky** » Thu May 22, 2014 4:44 pm

DexterPunk wrote:Did you have one of the 'UD' gigabyte mobos die on you?? Having a look at it, it's their 'Ultra Durable' range with thicker PCB and better components (3 yr warranty). It's what I got last time and has been going strong for around 5 years. I bought a Gigabyte vid card too, and no issues with that. I've had some bad experiences with Asus, and seen a hell of a lot of returns of their laptops... I'm not sure they are they company they were in the late 90's and the 2000's. I'm open to whatever though... I don't care for fanboism when it comes to computer parts, it's absurd.

I just checked the model of motherboard (965p-ds3) and it was one of the UD models and it died at 3 years 6 months, not long out of warranty.

The video card model escapes me, it was an 8800GT from memory that also crapped out for no apparent reason, just started with sparklies one day and they stayed, I assume either ram or a crook pcb trace to the ram, probably the latter given how the longer video cards tend to droop with age and this one had a good bow in it. It also had a 3 year warranty and died at 3 years 8 months so you can understand how I am a bit annoyed with Gigabyte.

In saying all that, while my experience with Gigabyte has been average, I must be a glutton for punishment because my last purchase was their 4GB 770GTX video card.

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Thu May 22, 2014 4:49 pm

Haha! Must have been a good deal to tempt you in.

That is pretty annoying to die just out of warranty like that. On the other hand at least they made it to their guaranteed life. I guess it's always going to be a bit of a lottery.

Anyone know if these ROG boards are worth the coin? I don't care about overclocking, better onboard sound, or fancy colour schemes.

Gizmo · Post by **Gizmo** » Thu May 22, 2014 5:00 pm

If you don't care for overclocking there is no need for a ROG mobo. The ROG stuff tents to be on the more expensive side if things, sure they got a bunch of extra features but if your not OCing I can't see it worth the money. In saying that though they sure do look pretty!!!

You can get a decent motherboard for $150ish these days.

Is the a gaming build or just wanting to update an old rig?

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Thu May 22, 2014 5:44 pm

Update old gaming rig that's all it will do.

Been looking at this...

http://www.gigabyte.com/products/produc ... x?pid=4978" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Looks alright.

Sent from Han Solo using TK-421's phone.

Sarsippius · Post by **Sarsippius** » Thu May 22, 2014 8:23 pm

Motherboards are another area where you can easily spend more money than you really need to. That board you're looking at is $250 on pccg, do you really need all that fancy stuff that it comes with? My current mobo was $130 and I suspect that level of board is probably all you really need.

richo · Post by **richo** » Thu May 22, 2014 8:41 pm

Put the extra $100 from the mobo onto the vid card or cpu .If the board has the same chipset as the expensive board I would bet you would be hard pressed to tell the difference .Imho anyway

Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Thu May 22, 2014 9:10 pm

I'm not much concerned with speed of the board. And not all that bothered by $100 more if it's quality. But I've really only just began my 'research'.

I very quickly chucked this together.

Intel Core i7 4790. $349
G.skill ripsaw 2x 4GB. $100
Gigabyte UD mobo. - $250
Radeon 4GB R9 290. $449
Samsung 840 EVO 250GB. $190
PSU - ~$200

I'm not looking to buy until after tax time, but generally like to thoroughly investigate these things. So that will all likely change. I figure $1500 ish should cover a decent build.

Also just wanted to say thanks heaps for the input and suggestions. I haven't looked at PC hardware in a long time, it's a lot to go through when you haven't been keeping up to date.

Sent from Han Solo using TK-421's phone.

Gizmo · Post by **Gizmo** » Fri May 23, 2014 8:28 am

I would sstay away from that R9 290 Dex. I built a rig for a friend last week and saw the same deal on PCCG. It's a cracking buy but what turned me away was it requies 400W of power just for the card and it runs at 95c....that is extremly hot!!!

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Fri May 23, 2014 11:33 am

So a hefty PSU is needed? I did see that they ran hot on the standard fans, I thought they might have improved it since release. Perhaps they are fine running at those temps? I was looking at the nvidia cards, but they don't seem to benchmark as well at that price point. The GTX 780 I think it was.

Sent from Han Solo using TK-421's phone.

ysu · Post by **ysu** » Fri May 23, 2014 1:18 pm

DexterPunk wrote:So a hefty PSU is needed? I did see that they ran hot on the standard fans, I thought they might have improved it since release. Perhaps they are fine running at those temps? I was looking at the nvidia cards, but they don't seem to benchmark as well at that price point. The GTX 780 I think it was.

There are usually a few issues with excessive heat:
1) if the cooler fails, or even does not work properly, the attachment isn't quite up to scratch, then the card may randomly overheat, reset, or completely fail. Hard-to-catch random resets can be in this category.
2) it heats up everything around it, unless you can take the heat completely out of the chassis (water block!)
3) The lifespan of the card maybe lower. Most electrical components should be good to about 120 C if I remember correctly, but I've read they'll work longer if they're operating at lower temps.

And yes, you need a tad larger PSU. Not too much, mind you. Going for a 1000W monster is overkill, but...
(I'm running two GTX 670s off a 850W Antec signature series, and it's getting I think 4 years old now. And PSUs lose efficiency continuously. The GTX670 is supposedly a 170W thingo, so it's 340W together. )

And also yes; you need to pay more for nVidia, usually.

That's a price I'm happy to pay, they're usually better in my experience - but your mileage may vary.

Edit: this article maybe interesting in this regard (power):
http://www.guru3d.com/articles_pages/ra ... rks,4.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Edit2: it looks the 290 is a 300W card, "only"

Gizmo · Post by **Gizmo** » Fri May 23, 2014 2:56 pm

Here you go Dex

Just pick yourself a case! This will rip up anything you throw at it!

http://www.pccasegear.com/sc/gIU" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Sat May 24, 2014 1:06 pm

Thanks YSU. That link is handy. I'm leaning back towards the 780. Or maybe watercooling the Radeon. I like my systems to be quiet.

Giz that's pretty close to what I'd want. I'm not decided on a HDD yet though, as I currently have one in my current rig I can use along with an SSD. Although it is pretty old.

Sent from Han Solo using TK-421's phone.

ysu · Post by **ysu** » Sat May 24, 2014 6:20 pm

DexterPunk wrote:Thanks YSU. That link is handy. I'm leaning back towards the 780. Or maybe watercooling the Radeon. I like my systems to be quiet.

Giz that's pretty close to what I'd want. I'm not decided on a HDD yet though, as I currently have one in my current rig I can use along with an SSD. Although it is pretty old.

Sent from Han Solo using TK-421's phone.

for the HDD I'd buy an SSHD - they're quite a bit faster than a regular one, altho cost a bit more. This is the one I got (actually two of these, one for the wife's computer, too):
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?mai ... &cPath=344" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

As for quiet; the wc system may not be the quiet solution you're looking for... if you think about it; it has a pump PLUS a fan, whereas the air cooler has a fan only. The main advantage is that it can put the heat right outside the case, and provide a more effective cooling solution, often. Although in some cases the cooler fan can double as a case fan. But if you want a positive pressure case - with filtered intakes to avoid dust build-up! - you have to watch how/where you put exhaust fans.

So for quiet, you need to look at fanless, or slow-spinning fan solutions (usually nice big fans that operate at a low RPM).

DexterPunk · Post by **DexterPunk** » Sat May 24, 2014 7:10 pm

Last water cooled PC I made was using a heatercore from a Falcon, and an 80mm case fan that was nice and quiet. I would have thought the water cooling solutions would use larger slower fans than the wee little ones on a GPU?

Thanks for that link, I'll check it out.

Sent from Han Solo using TK-421's phone.

ysu · Post by **ysu** » Sat May 24, 2014 8:35 pm

DexterPunk wrote:Last water cooled PC I made was using a heatercore from a Falcon, and an 80mm case fan that was nice and quiet. I would have thought the water cooling solutions would use larger slower fans than the wee little ones on a GPU?.

That's true. Altho if you water-cool your gfx card you might need to leave the cpu on stock or air...or get a case that can handle it all, or a custom cpu/gpu wc. It can get complicated

What I've realised that it only matters to me when I'm working. The pc can wind down all fans (there are about 6 overall - the case has 3 120mm intake fans at the bottom) to a minimum when it's not under stress. So the daily work noise is negligible - and the pc sits on my desk, just behind the monitors, so it's close to my head. When I'm gaming, I have more noise coming from the headphones (or the bloody steering wheel!) than from the pc, even though the fans are working.

Mind you, I had a noisy gfx card solution before and that was bad. A single whining fan can ruin your life, for sure!
Lucky these 670's run fairly cool, plus I could install them with a gap, so the fans never get too excited.

A.R.S.E.